• Gupta Vishad

    Initially, the reservation was made to overcome the gap between the rich and the poor people but as the time passes the politicians make it powerful tool to woo the votes by making false commitments.
    This gap is continuously increasing instead of coming down in India. So conditions of poor is not going to improve while they are feeling unsafe in India as inflation is rising but they are not getting so much facilities as government is offering them because of the lack of awareness and education among those people.
    Dalits can be made safe by knowing their own rights that government are offering them. They have to be aware and educate their children so that government aided programmes can reach up to them.

    • Harshit J

      Constitutional reservation was not meant for overcoming gap between rich and poor, it was to give voice to the unrepresented.What use is money if a fellow human being does not treat you equal, or worse human.

    • Amardeep Kumar

      please correct yourself.the purpose of giving reservation to dalits was to eliminate the social discrimination , not to remove poverty.

  • ronak kothari

    Are dalit safe in india?
    We been a independent and Republic country for past 68 years.
    What we are saying isn’t first case or last case of dalit been killed,but what is we are talking here is just one side of th coin.
    Dalits aren’t only people who being killed and not first instance of a dalit or an indian being killed.
    I will like to call it indian and not dalit as i dont believe in. Caste system and neither do our Constitution,the media who is reporting is spreading more venom by not articulating facts but by showing propagation news.
    For me every indian is indian and not a dalit or swarna.
    These division on caste line is nithing more then politics for me.
    Every indian whether he i from dalit sc st obc open every indian is safe.
    Every country has its flawd.
    This is ours we need to work on it and we are working on it

    • VJM

      You are very right ronak kothari. If every Indian sees others as Indian and not with their caste and religion then we may be in a place where Rabindranath Tagore wanted this country to take. But everyday we are seeing news in oneway or the other about such heinous incidents of intolerance. People might have forgotten the “theory of evolution” and thinking that every caste has born on their own.

      • ronak kothari

        We as a nation failed in a simple Department thats is after 68 years of independence we cant and we aren’t able to get our mindset correct,we are the one of those countries who used to have the richest cultural heritage in world but we are failing to empower our people we need to bring every stake holder of the society to the same table and that to a round table so no one is superior than one another.
        What we need is to curb andclosed down those political parties who is been playing appeasement game for long time.
        Empower people dont make them beggars

  • Sree

    Structural violence in India is almost daily occurrence. Dalits are targeted routinely. Dalits are yet be given full access to constitution.

  • Rinoy Innocent

    Different people will have different opinion on this.What I’m saying is my personal opinion.I welcome other perspectives.Even though in the colonial days dalits and suppressed classes were deprived of the basic needs, After the inception of democracy the situation has changed.Now they’re the real beneficiaries of the democratic edifice in India because of the reservation system.But there is another side as well as they’re being targeted and killed by certain anti-social elements.It is the responsibility of the Nation to provide their citizen with basic needs and the govt.should work on it.

    • black mamba

      really?
      as far as i know, the % of SC population is 17%
      but their representation in services is 11%
      % of st population is 8%; representation is 4%

      it is misguided to say that they are the real beneficiaries.
      certain families in the creamy layer definitely are, but on a head count, how many of them are there? barely 2% of the entire combined population of sc and st together – that amounts to just not enough.

      go in the hinterlands and villages of india, they are still discriminated against.
      no matter what job you are at, societal difference would always be there

      • Wolverine

        I appreciate your answer 🙂

      • mohd osama

        Kudos for this eye opener facts

    • Wolverine

      I would like to your statement saying that they are the real beneficiaries of democracy.

      According to Class 12 Sociology NCERT, the concept of ‘Caste Becoming absent for upper class and become more worse for the lower class’ including Dalits. With the inception of Democracy, We provided jobs on the basis of No discrimination between upper castes and lower castes even though the Upper Class Section of the population was relatively well off and had access to higher education. This ‘On A PAR’ condition made the former to bag jobs while the latter to remain deprive.

      Over the generation, the caste became ABSENT for the Upper Caste and SEVERE for the lower caste.

      and the Centuries old Discrimination more or less maintained a status quo.

      Concept of Differentiation = Rich became RiCHER and poor Became POORER.

      Hence Proved = They are not the real beneficiaries of the democratic edifice in India.

      • black mamba

        exactly, caste has infact become absent for upper class and sever or even worst for lower class.
        thanks for adding on to my point.
        you have just made it pretty clear with the detailed explanation 🙂

        • Wolverine

          I think I don’t need to reply on your Long Long comment now. 🙂

          • black mamba

            hahhaa
            omg its a debate
            i would appreciate a come back 🙂

            thanks for the value addition btw
            this is a very sensitive topic with high probability to be not balanced.

  • black mamba

    The question is not so much about safety as it is about unfair and derogatory treatment that they are subjected to.
    the distinction between caste has been historical and it has been so well engraved under the skin majority of indian population that a lot of time, atrocities on dalits come about as an extension of social supremacy over them. The pervading feeling amongst the attackers is mostly that, this community is helpless and they are meant to take all the crap we can give them and we can get away from doing whatever we wsh to them.
    and in fact, this is something that happens. Had this recent incident not taken place near NCR no one would have batted and eyelid.
    discrimination against dalits continues and would continue until certain ground level social, political and economic changes are not made.

    • Wolverine

      Two places I would like to counter you my friend.
      First is where you are saying that Had this recent incident not taken place near NCR no one would have batted an eyelid. I feel that In this age of Electronic Media incidents like this is usually reported and are in news. An Incident related to an Australian sporting a religious tattoo in Bangaluru is widely condemned by all. There are many incidents of atrocities which are reported by Media. It is actually the gravity of an issue which makes it more significant for people.

      Second place where I want to counter is – the last line which says that the discrimination would continue until certain ground level social, political and economic changes are not made.

      I think there have already Social, Political and Economic Schemes for their welfare but it’s just that the AGES OLD MINDSET OF PEOPLE IS NOT CHANGING AND THAT’S IS WHAT WE NEED TO CHANGE ONCE AND FOR ALL 🙂

      • black mamba

        bengaluru?
        wait is that a metro? yes.
        please don’t take the statement for its face-value only. what i meant was, in the with-drawn villages of india, now be it in up, tamil nadu, jharkhand or bihar or haryana, doesn’t matter, caste is still a big big player. same goes for gender issues. people are not allowed to enter temples, houses, touch the food/water of upper caste people etc. and when these ‘rules’ are not abided by, the ‘perpetrator’ is ruthlessly ‘punished’.
        on the other hand, when an incident is highly political in nature, its not even allowed to be reported, many times it still manages to be in news, and many times doesn’t. this is a well known reality. there are definite shades of grey present in the system. the poor villages don’t even have electricity or road, where will the media come from? look I’m not generalising, and thats precisely my point, we can’t generalise that media is everywhere and it reports.

        now coming to the changes.
        you saying ‘mindset’. i ask mindset of whom? oh yes SOCIETY.
        and why political? well i fail to understand why even after 69 years we still haven’t reached proportional representation in the services and employment.? LACK OF POLITICAL WILL i believe. WHY IS CASTE STILL AN ISSUE IN VOTE-BANK POLITICS?

        • Wolverine

          Metro == Oh My God, Don’t you think the Examiner would have cut your marks by now?
          Though, We are not writing the exams right now but mistakes become habit and habit if not good may cost us dearly. (Take it like a good friend is advising you)
          Rest All is Good. and I too Agree with what you are saying.
          WHY IS CASTE STILL AN ISSUE IN VOTE-BANK POLITICS?

          Answer — Because Political Parties have to run their shops and This can be done by Exploiting differences which If are of Perpetual Nature, They will be earning their bread and butter for ever. 🙂

          • black mamba

            its a debate – prepping us for the interview.
            not secure mains writing session where we need to worry about word limit and formats 😛

            so yeah – bengaluru is a metropolitan well connected city. >>> change made.

            yeah agreed the bread and butter thing.
            but you know they make these hate crimes happen too.
            just look at what shiv sena is doing now? in a way causing international ridicule for india.
            yeah it’s way off the topic, but come on same issue can be extended to minorities in india,
            it’s all the diversity in its full glory that makes india INDIA. There should be some checks on the caste and communal politics. something that EC can do. suggestions?

            • Wolverine

              No. Election Commission can’t just jump into this matter.
              Reason being, It is related to the Future Government’s Social schemes and any intervention by it would result in No promises during Elections = No Working later.
              Moreover, The supreme court too has said that the Candidates can go for speeches related to castes until they are not inciting the violence and It is also their Constitutional freedom.

              I too was thinking of connecting the ShivSena Events with this topic but was not able to think how to connect this remote topic.

              • black mamba

                Yea you are right.
                Dark side of democracy I guess. U can’t take away people’s rights. Everything does have good and bad, so does democracy

  • gugha priya

    Dalits seemed to be unsafe in India. Though they are safeguarded by the constitution (Article 14, 15 and 17) and the Scheduled Castes and Tribes (Prevention of Atrocities) Act, 1989, deep rooted caste system periled them to caste based murders, rape, physical
    conflicts and also social and emotional boycott.
    As most of them are economically nonviable, makes them dependent on rich non-dalits and repress them. Though Reservation was laid out to subdue this gap, impoverished status seemed to be not retreating from this class of society as the education policies and its significance have not reached them completely. Rate of children going to school is still less than other communities though there has been gradual increase in past years.

    Stringent punishments against dalit atrocities and the firm and strong role and support of National commission of SC and ST would help to alleviate this national issue.

    • Mehaboob T

      Friend if not wrong, since commission of SC and ST are constitutional bodies they have independance of dealing matters related but the access to such type bodies by people(dalit) is rarest so I feel the root cause to heal the matter is to provide best education facility by having number of govt std schools so that they get aware of world and their rights comprehensively and fight for their right, though constitutional provides many of safeguards to minorities the matter lies only on paper than practical fact, all we need is easy access to education, number of govt employment and media should play enough role in awaring the minorities on social issues, in present scenario as you hold up we utter that dalit seems to be unsafe in INDIA.

      • gugha priya

        Hi Friend! Completely agree your point. What I was trying to convey is, some of the functions of the commission are:
        a. To investigate and monitor all matters relating to the safeguards provided for the Scheduled Castes under this Constitution or under any other law for the time being in force or under any order of the Government and to evaluate the working of such safeguards;
        b. To inquire into specific complaints with respect to the deprivation of rights and safeguards of the Scheduled Castes

        Based on the above responsibilities, they should also pitch in and provide necessary support whenever any atrocities are caused to SC and STs and wherever applicable.

        Having said that and as you say, seeing the violence incurred on this section, education and the heightening of their social status could only obviate these issues.

        Thanks friend for the review and very valid comments 🙂

    • Shivaraj

      good points

      • gugha priya

        HI Shivaraj! thanks much for the review and the comments 🙂

    • EnigmaIndia

      diversified……good

      • gugha priya

        HI EnigmaIndia, thanks much for the review and the comments 🙂

        • EnigmaIndia

          WC

  • Abhisek Dash

    The term “Dalit” itself signifies that they are the crushed ones. Never are they allowed to uplift on their own.

    Of course, the term makes a distinction among the people on the basis of their social stature and influence.

    If seen, on the lines of Vedas, the differentiation was already done. The Brahmanas, the Kshatriyas, the Vaishyas, the Shudras, these are not only just class divisions of the Hindu society but also they are instrumental in paving way for the ruthless mindset of the people. In present days, the lower 2 sections of the Hindu society are considered to be Dalits!

    Their rights have always been trampled by the ambitious upper class. Many a great people, like B R Ambedkar, have emerged from the swamp of hatredness to go on to revolutionise the Dalit struggle.

    Coming to their safety, they are not only vulnerable socially but also economically. Though the government has passed adequate legislations to safeguard Dalit interests, it still depends on the majority of the Indians on how they perceive their Dalit competitors. As Indians or just as Dalits?

    • black mamba

      you’ve presented a valid opening. but missed to answer the question

      • Abhisek Dash

        yup.. I realized it afterwards!
        Thanks a lot 🙂

  • ved singh

    accordin to constitution and law of the land it can be assumed that yes dalit are safe.but the real picture is undeniable fact that dalits are not just unsafe but still unware of their right which can make them safe.This is the section which is tradinaly underestimated ignored and stigmatised.today in so called our moder generation also,the mentality prevail that all the lowskilled and sanitary type of job are made to be done by them only.Dalits hardly found their voice heard.
    Econimicaly they are insecured,hardly any public policy or benificiry scheme percolate down to their level.also deprive of land.
    Politicaly thinking,they are best souce of vote as they can be easily lured,but hardly gain justice from their representator
    s.

  • Wolverine

    Dalits or ‘Downtrodden People’ are long been subjected to Atrocities. Atrocities is defined as Practices which are inhumane. It’s a centuries old phenomeno which has been fought bravely by Social and Political reformers of 18th and 19th Century like Jotiba Phule, Sri Narayan Guru and Mahatma Gandhi. It was Mahatma Gandhi who gave them the sobriquet ‘Harijan’ meaning ‘People of God’ to change the mindset of upper caste population of the nation towards them. He imagined an Independent India, not just from the British Rule but also from the centuries old ‘Caste System’. However, India didn’t become the way he imagined fully. Caste System is still prevalent in India and is practised in parts of the country in some form or the other. The Recent Incidents of GangRape, Murders and Social Ostracisation tell us that the Dalits are not safe in India. Though, there have been Constitutional Guarantee for Equal treatment, Abolition of Untouchability, Political Justice and Acts preventing Atrocities such as ‘Prevention of Atrocities Act 1989’. They are still subjected to traditional practices. It is time that we should reform the mindsets of our people through Information, Education and Communication along with amending POA Act and continuing with the Affirmative Action to bring them in mainstream and concomitantly to eradicate the Social discrimination against them which has thrived for hundreds of years now.

    • anvit

      1) Though, there have been Constitutional Guarantee for Equal treatment, Abolition of Untouchability, Political Justice and Acts preventing Atrocities such as ‘Prevention of Atrocities Act 1989’. They are still subjected to traditional practices…………………………………Why ? Are the legal and constitutional provisions inadequate or not implemented properly ? how can we ensure they are implemented.

      2) It is time that we should reform the mindsets of our people through Information, Education and Communication………how , has not gvt done anything in this direction ??

      3) along with amending POA Act ……why should we amend it (what are shortcomings) , how (suggestions)??

      4)continuing with the Affirmative Action to bring them in mainstream and concomitantly to eradicate the Social discrimination against them which has thrived for hundreds of years now………………………….Affirmative action have helped to remove discrimination?? has not particular section of dalits cream the benefits generation after generation???What about the poor dalits which are still marginalized ?? Do our affirmative action policy need a relook?

  • prem vind

    India is ethnically and culturaly diverse country. Their people have different interest according to heir socio-economic condition.Our constitution hv given safegaurge to them for varsatile development so that philosophy of Unionism must be enjoyed . its unfortunate for country now the intollrance amonge the people is mushrooming and enchroching by affecting our lung of cultural unity in form of chronic desease. the frustration of younge generation is clearily visible in form of insecurity by attacking on soft target , not only to dalits of India but also some minority class too.

    India is culturaly enriched country but the beauty of its is its potential unionism , britherhood and nationalis. Its is not only protected by Indian constitution in dioffernt articles but it was inplimented enthusistically by almost all governments . Their is some loophole too that must not be ignored by policy makers so that the the dalits of this country start feeling insecure , victmised with political previlages. At the time of election period people use all equations to get represented in pariament and assembly but alfter taht all manufastos become manuscript in dead boxes.

    Indian society is now headeing towards intollerance . Its agressive attituted is leading inida’s future in direction of unforseen desausers. So many dalits is now targeted by differnt politically supported groups. Not only dalits even muslims are targeted to feel insecure in this nation. Brutality towards woman of dalits and Adiwasis are targeted not only external hooligans but also even their domest. Most of rape cases are related to the poor and dalits woman and children.

    Education and ethical values are key reason to this type to psychological change in our society. We are adopting western culture without western like education. so their is large gap between western culture and indian value imparting systems like education and cultural strongeness. We very easily adopt western fashion and culture and living style but not adpoting their values system. This generate conflict in our inner and start affecting in devastating way.

    India philosophy is very strong and time tested and surviving long evon. This taught us to be tolarant and polite for all living species . But Its degradation is seen in form of killing , torturing and harrasing to dalits and other poor section of society.

    Though India ‘ economic growth is quite smooth but still we are living in severe poverty event being house of lagest poors in the world. According to HDI report and others most of Indian youth are frusted and disillusioned . they Dont have employment and earning for livlihood .And our political system start playing game in for of intollarence targeting poor and dalits.

    india now should have taken a bold steps for securing unity in diversity . Our education system must teach a values of humanity , ethics and cultural . So that society should becaome tolerant . And India become a home for all .

    • prem vind

      Society is heading toward intolerance………

      • prem vind

        Its psychological change and value degradation of our systems and thus dalits , women , poor and children are targeted…………..

        • Supriya Sharma

          so if the roots are that deep down, initiatives have to be taken from that level. I guess schools should play an important part in framing the overall ideology of children, teaching them the moral values and the qualities of treating everyone equally irrespective of caste and creed. Laws can punish but won’t change the psychology

          • Mehaboob T

            Absolutely its all about the role of education, its the duty of country to educate its citizen by providing std education with easy accessibility and have number schools in areas of attention.

            • Supriya Sharma

              yes!! “Areas of attention” is also an imp. thing govt. needs to look into because these are where education is a lot lagging and all the fruits of reservation mostly consumed by already good enough. I guess reservation norms need to be revised now focussing attention on those who need it the most today…….critics welcomed

          • prem vind

            Yeah supriya…unless we a wholistic approach from grassroot from all interconnected system we cant wipe out this syndrome from our society……..Basic education can play a key role in building bright mind and sole in young Indian Mind…..

    • prem vind

      Must read….dont avoid…………

    • Mehaboob T

      It is very much true that we very easily adopt western fashion and culture, living style but not adopting their values system. Still engaged in stereotypes and prejudices which weaken the radical and oneness features of human beings. In case of education its not the minority or dalit group who has to be blamed for their low rates it is matter of govt in democracy countries to provide easy access of quality and std education in essential areas rather than counting schools in cities and praising one..

      • black mamba

        western system also has prejudices, and stereotypes.
        apartheid? does it ring a bell ?
        racism?
        sexism/? well sexism is universally present but still.

        discrimination on the ‘accident of birth’ is not unique to india

      • prem vind

        government’s reluctance is a kind of promotion of intolerance….. Dilitism is still in our mind and patronised by orthodoxism of our society…

  • 5212

    At the present scenario that is happening around in our country anyone who is on the concern of dalits could feel that “Cows or the domesticated-animals are much safer than the dalits”. This is felt so because we can see many of the extremist actions of safe-gaurding the cattle is going on around, but the deprived ones are suppressed more into the ground.
    These downtrodden people so termed dalits are asking to show some humanitarian concern towards them. These people are neglected and has been showcased as if they are puppets in the hands of upper-castes. We have seen many instances of how the cases go vanished if any of heinous crimes are committed against them. This is because they lack support and out of fear for their lives they just withdraw their cases. Many of the national commissions are not doing their best to tackle out these problems. They are like snake without fangs.
    For many of atrocities being reported what the victims feel is that “Why do we have no organized support at least on par with cattle”?

    • Wolverine

      last line is more than good.

      I don’t think that Blaming the National Commissions is right because whatever they are doing they can’t change the Centuries old mindset of people and also can’t make and implement schemes on their own for the betterment of Dalits. Say for example We have NHRC which comes into action after an incident has happened. Given it’s different Modus Operandi, would it be right to blame it?

      • 5212

        I just was the on the concern of many committees that are appointed to forsee the status of the dalits. What I feel is that they are not satisfactorily working. May be they are yielded politically to debaunch the reports that have been made. The committes should be given freedom to function independent of oppression. It should be the responsibility of government to make sure that the schemes launched to benefit dalits , reach them and aid them. “When this fails, this is what is called as neglecting the downtrodden”.

        • Wolverine

          You wrote Commissions in the Original text and not committees my friend.
          I Understand what you meant now. 🙂

  • Manish Chandran

    Asking such a direct question aiming at a particular group such as Dalit is pointless, as all those individual or family which face the challenge of subsistence on day to day basis, safety is a concern for them. Such safety cannot be confined to any one aspect, but includes wider aspects such as Social safety, economic safety and cultural safety. India primarily can be categorized as largely an unequal country in the said aspects especially economic. Economic aspect is the dominating factor in the 21st century after which social and cultural aspects closely follow. If a dalit family is not able to quench their hunger or are employed in meagre wages they by default become subordinates of the ruling class to which the stereotype social and cultural stigma adds on. Yes, they are not safe because our efforts in the direction still is shallow in empowering them. Despite so many constitutional provisions such as Article 17 (abolishing untouchability), Article 19 (clause 5) which prioritize ST people’s needs, Article 25 (Right against exploitation), Dalit’s condition has improved marginally. A more concerted effort was required in the past which unfortunately got restricted to the politics of class reservation. No doubt, reservation is important, however its incomplete without empowerment. In villages especially, Dalits are not aware of all the provisions they have which the govt. has to be held responsible. Only abolishing manual scavenging will not stop it, as a responsible govt., they should be alternatively provided with income channels which didn’t happen and as a result manual scavenging is still a livelihood for large number of Dalits. Doing such jobs puts them in the spectrum of people of higher class as ‘impure’. The worst part is the so called higher class is not ready to change their attitude. So in the Enforcement VS Empowerment battle, the Central govt. again bent their minds towards enforcement as the way to end issues of Dalit and propsed an amendment to the Prevention of Atrocities against SC/ST Act, 1989 and the bill is in the parliament. New provisions such as abolishing “footwear garlanding’, forcing to vote, sexual abuse (even touching) without consent of Dalit women does looks promising in the enforcement part. The question is there are already lot of enforcement in place which becomes just pieces of paper with passing time.
    So, the question is How can a Dalit be safe when ‘they are not provided with the proper resources to grow and develop and come on an equal footing in terms of economic and social indicators with the higher resourceful class? Lets frame policy which are more focused and sustainable. Lets empower them!

  • Dibyojyoti Chatterjee

    Though constitution provides protection to so called depressed classes it has not been applied effectively homogenously at all part of India. I think more than the discrimination between “dalits” and “not dalits” its the discrimination among economically backward and advanced people which is the root cause of the atrocities.
    Where ever there is large inequalities of income, lack of education prorogating irrational religious sentiments or areas where power is unevenly distributed(AFSPA areas)there has been cases of extortions,rapes,murder, atrocities.
    The new SC,ST bill(Prevention of Atrocities) provides addition of new offences which is a step ahead in right direction. Forcing manual scavenging is now a non bailable offense. So we have seen moves which seems to protect the so called oppressed classes.
    But the human nature of treating another human being below par and brutality does not arises specifically only for dalits. it is lack of moral education which is more responsible. Cases of brutality on dalits is only a subset of the over all unfair treatment caused due to unequal distribution of wealth, resources and opportunities.

    • Harshit J

      Having passed bills and not ensuring implementation is an old problem, is manual scavenging truly eliminated?. One must understand that if you are economically backward, you still have your dignity intact, which is not the case in social backwardness, hence it would be wrong to compare the two. The “dehumanized” treatment will never occur in case of economic backwardness. Discussing discrimination between economically backward and advanced people is also important, however that is not to be discussed within the ambit of this discussion.

      • Dibyojyoti Chatterjee

        is manual scaveninf truely eliminated or not thats a seperate questn altogether. there will be surely still instances of that bt defintely not as widespread as it used to be.
        and to some extent i agree wd ur point of difference between socially and economically backward but in many cases a person is both. it is very difficult to demarcate between the two backwardnesses atleats from SECC data.
        My answers main point was that the atrocities on dalits are a part of the atrocities caused due to various factor, when a massacre happens no boy asks what ur caste what ur religion? its only the stronger who dominates the weak no matter how unfair it is

  • Dibyojyoti Chatterjee

    Please comment on my opinion

  • Vandana Dugar

    A question that has always been remained to answer.!! I feel that Dalits are not safe in India even after being a democratic state. The Dalits are prone to severe hardships and face a hell lot of discrimination be it politically, socially, or economically.The Dalit case in Haryana where 2 children were burnt is a clear example to prove how they are being harmed. Another one is of Bihar, where a person who was Dalit, his family was forced from their homes to two districts of since he stood against a upper caste person.. this is nothing but caste related violence which they face everyday.. even after POA they still suffer..
    even after having the right to reservation in colleges and schools they are the one being denied because of their”CASTE”. So even after so much atrocities ..
    the question still remains to answer by our nation are Dalits safe in India?? if not then why cant each one of can take some initiative to stop these atrocities towards them by creating awareness and educating the others that they are also creations of god and they have the same rights as US..

    • anvit

      How to break caste prejudices and social hierarchy……Suggestions??
      Through education…….we already have reservations???
      Empowering them…….how ?? What initiatives can we take ??
      We should address WHY do they still suffer ????

      • Vandana Dugar

        even though we have reservations some of the backward people are not aware of this.. and i feel that by educating them we can to some extent make them aware.. and because they are not aware of their privileges they suffer.. by enforcing the law seriously!

  • naren

    Dr. Bhim rao ambedkar framed the constitution and put wider scope for the equality . But still lower caste like Dalit are not safe and face enormous humiliation from the upper caste , this raise big question mark on the India’s secular status . Main problem behind this caste attack is not complete infusion between the upper caste and lower caste . People in village organise separate function like ganpati , shivratri , janmasthmi for upper caste and lower caste . Indian government reservation schemes is big culprit behind this unsafe reason however , reservation categorise the people from SC/ST TO GENERAL .When child born more people know about his caste as SC/ST get more benefit from the government schemes in the hospital , this imbibe feeling of lower caste in the child which creates more wider gap between the upper and lower caste . Even in the school upper caste child do not like to eat with lower caste child , then it is difficult for the society to come closer , celebrate festivals together many more .
    How this gap will be reduce ?
    1.If government instead of caste based reservation make norms for economically backward reservation system , then people will help in hospital for the birth of a child from lower caste as caste is economically backward irrespective of his caste either SC/ ST or backward class , this will grow seeds of fraternity and lessen the gape of upper and lower caste and dalit story of murder , rape will not happen and not become headline for the news .
    2. Government need not to recognise any caste based schemes , recruitment etc.
    In urban areas this gap is already at low level , will reduce further with common motive of development and jobs opportunities .

    • Harshit J

      Friend, I love your optimism, however if reservation is removed, the discrimination will become more rampant. The scheme needs evaluation but not removal. Now only a few people within socially backward continue to reap benefits, a large number still have to benefit from it, steps should be taken to achieve that objective.

      I feel economic backward reservation is an easy way out, Why not ensure everybody gets equal opportunity and same quality of education, this will actually ensure proper upliftment of all, then no reservation based on economic criteria will be needed.

      • naren

        thank you . Equal opportunities for all is also a good point to eradicate discrimination gap .

  • shakeel ahmed

    It is not at all about the Dalit but the real discrimination and atrocity are prevailed for the poor. There are other castes also who are deprived of basic needs of food, security and life of dignity and it is not because they belong to a particular caste but they are poor community. If a dalit is a political leader, does he face such discrimination? No. However, higher caste people maintain distance with him but their hatred doesn’t get surfaced to him. Today, the poor and lower castes are interchangeable terms and the any kind of social exploitation always fall to weaker section.

  • Manoj

    Even after 6 decades of independence the conditions of dalits remains largely marginalised.

    Even today social evils like untouchability, discriminations still is deep routed in large parts of the country. Though the efforts from govt and provisions of the constitution has helped to reduce it but we are still par from uprooting it.

    Though we have reservations for them, we are still not able to empower them. We effectively need to empower them. The situation is more about being marginalisation in the society.

    Along with reservations in political sector, we need to make thier presence felt. It’s with thier strong presence the social evils can be uprooted. Main target arena should be our representatives in the local govt where the local leaders need to groomed so that they can build a strong base as leaders and even in the absence of reservation they must be able to represent the constituencies. When theres this broad acceptance for a leader the community as a whole will be benefitted.

    Theres also need to educate and empower the dalits. Theres also some stigma which had made them to accept the things in suo motto rather than bringing about the change. Recently a Senior MP belonging to backward community refused to enter the temple premises, he’s a Senior MP and his name was even doing rounds for ministerial berth in NDA govt. If a Senior member elected representative who should have spear headed the movement against evils, still practices it the whole efforts of reservations fail miserably. And there will be sense of fear as being treated as marginalised. A recent incident in haryana has made us a shook our head in shame.

    Political empowerment is a key to eliminate the marginalisation.

    • shakeel ahmed

      How political empowerment is key?

      • Manoj

        Political empowerment will serve two purposes it will help them to stand against the atrocities and command thier rights. And peoples attitude towards them will take a back seat once they are dominant. Yes proples change in attitude must come from within. But political empowerment can be a catalyst to the upliftment.

  • mohd osama

    Dalits are among the most oppressed section of people.
    In spite of reservation, which is stated as a proof of their well being, their situation is deplorable.
    Recent cases in bihar shows that, the wedge created by Dalits asserting for political space, has met with extreme reactions.
    The very term, we use like upper caste, lower caste, pandit, dalit, etc, gives an identity. And this identity has a permanent standing. Almost everytime, when cases like recent one in delhi, in which petrol and flame used on sleeping family, Killing children, the onus lies on the idea of permanent identity.
    The Constitution of 1950, had promised many emancipated provisions. But as we can see, those provisions are of no avail.
    Solution lies only in strict policing, fast punishment, conviction and just judiciary.
    Otherwise, being dalit, inspite of Constitutional guarantees, won’t, bring anything. Notwithstanding, economic liberalization and financial inclusion.

    • Harshit J

      Kudos brother, This is one of the few opinions which has actually stayed true to today’s discussion. Otherwise the discussion on safety has been transformed into “critical analysis” of reservation system.You have managed to do some justice to the discussion.Well done.

      • mohd osama

        Tjanx

    • shakeel ahmed

      All the solution you suggested may bring short term solution. Suppose, a situation where a higher caste family doesn’t invite Dalit family on the occasion of any ceremony or festival. Doesn’t it amount to hatred or discrimination against Dalit family? In such situation no law can enforce to share such happy moments with dalits. Awaremenss and humanitarian knowledge of Common people can only change the scenario in long term and it is possible only when we will impart the right education from school itself. So, it is highly possible that the next generation may not keep such discrimination against dalit or suppressed class of society.

      • black mamba

        right education is needed. agreed.
        but many times, even after that, the situation is the same.
        i think it should be right education of the masses along with economic upliftment of the dalits (and other minorities) that would speed up the parity process. society,politics and economy is all interconnected and can’t be looked at in isolation.

        • ravinder yadav

          indeed friend..
          right education holds a key to solution of lots of social problems, caste is one of them. we may form new & more strict laws & policies but its not going to give the desired result, same as in the cases of crimes against women.
          laws become effective only when it is revered by country men. only an aware and responsible citizen will do that.
          to develop such citizen it is need of hour that proper changes are done in the educ. system.
          it’s not that all these were never taught in schools, but rather like a small regular topics.may be that its requirement was not felt much till now. but current scenario of deteriorating social fabric demands that moral teaching be made a highlight of indian educ, system.
          second thing, we need teachers which are well trained committed and not prejudiced as it is quite possible that in present social atmosphere they may have their own conceptions. and in such case whatever may be written in a book it will be of no use.
          changing mind set is the only long term solution of such problems which do require effective educ. system.

        • mohd osama

          Yes, but economic upliftment and education are related. Education or appropriate education can make them go onto upper class in hierarchy but economic upliftment without educational provision would be short term.

      • mohd osama

        Yes, u r right. But when a person gets hit by an arrow, taking arrow out is necessary. Long term would come after short term achievements. Ur point is not required in the debate. It would hav been good, if debate would be on solutions for dalits emancipation.!

    • black mamba

      you can also add limiting the influence of caste politics in state-centre elections (it will always be there in third tier election as the electorate is so small and would definitely relate to the immediate identifying cause). EC should establish stricter norms for ensuring this.
      Same can be done for prevention of giving communal color to elections too.

    • ram T

      these atrocities which we see , is majorly observed in the rural areas..why? its because people have lots of free time over there ,hence the age old customs still have firm grounds..as contrast to your last sentence , i strictly think that if the wheels of economic momentum are set running, where people of different castes would have to work side by side rather a patron-client relation (as in fileds) would definitely be a soultion .

      • mohd osama

        Sir, may be you dnt know that, in the cities like bangalore, these things are happening. Financial streamlining could be the solution, but in the long term caste system has to go.

    • Bruce wayne

      Totally agree with you, these is actually collision between permanent identity.
      In my view too the day when there will be no attachment to the surname develop.matrimonial ad without asking the caste etc that day we can think that yes society is reaching toward equality to every one. As the gentle man said it’s because of excess of time seem improbable.
      Every one saying about right education, right education was always there, but some people don’t want to accept that

    • Anurag

      Nicely comprehended !! Just one thing I feel to point out, maybe I am wrong and if so please correct me. “emancipated provisions” although everyone like me has got the idea conveyed therein yet grammatically i feel it isn’t correct. It gives literal meaning like the provisions themselves ought to be the beneficiaries of emancipation.

      • mohd osama

        Actually it should be emancipatory provisions. The meaning is this, that the provisions are there in the Constitution, which promises freedom to dalits and other marginalised communities. This was i meant by emancipatory.

    • Deepak

      Apart from a transparent and accountable, fast criminal justice system other basis of emancipation include- Economic like dalit capitalism, Political like Dalit assertion by providing leadership to other economically marginalised communities as happend under BSP in UP and being tried in case of Bihar, Punjab now. Modern education and liberal education will certainly change the Mindset but it will take long time.

  • AP

    The inhumane act of burning of a Dalit family in Sunpedh, Faridabad is the reflection of a part of society that proves the point that the Dalit community or the “people of God” the Harijans are definitely not safe in India.
    But is it an all India Scenerio, the answer to that would certainly be No because one the one hand when a Harijan is not even allowed to enter the temple(Eg. Some villages in north India) on the other he acts as a priest of one of the most sacred temples I. E Tirupati, Tirumala shrine.
    So India as a whole is not unsafe for dalits but there are pockets where the ancient mindset still prevails like Faridabad incident mentioned above and there the law needs to take its strictest course possible.
    And the solution should start from the education, even if the NCERTs are taught with compassion the future generation mindset could be easily moulded in areas where the cast prejudice prevails, but that is not going to happen when a teacher teaches about untouchability keeping a particular section out of class.

  • Bruce wayne

    It’s true that dalit are not safe in our country still after 70 years of independence even after giving so many constitutional safeguards to them. This seems to be like expecting a miracle to get this condition improved in just 70 years which are created in thousands years and got there presence in deep in mind set of Indian people.
    This discrimination so deep that even in names of people in India affected by this,where higher caste proudly say there surname as their identity to there status. The height of hypocrisy in this caste system is that they get polluted by even their shadows some times but nothing happened when they raped dalit woman’s or beat or exploit dalit people.
    The reason of these conditions are the solution to this insecurity. There educational,economic,political,social weakness is main reason for this conditions. constitutional rights have to become active on ground, for this support from higher authority is needed. If this situation have to reverse then effort should be made from within and outside of dalits community with help of multiple pillars of our democracy like free media,civil society,intellectuals etc to empower them in multiple fields.

    • anvit

      It’s true that dalit are not safe in our country still……..safe from whom??.upper caste only…….what about social safety , economic justice, political freedom?

      There educational,economic,political,social weakness is main reason for this conditions……………..Do reservations policy not helping them…….reservation in politics, education ,jobs ??

      help of multiple pillars of our democracy like free media,civil society,intellectuals etc to empower them …………..how to empower them,

      Could include –
      Affect of LPG,1991 reforms on their conditions….dalit entrepreneurs
      Representation in media
      Increase in higher Judiciary

      • Bruce wayne

        When the debate issue is dalit safe that mean topic divide it into dalit and other community, it’s not about safety from wild animals. It is from social animals.
        Effect of LPG can’t see much effect of this. Because this castesystem have changed the mindset of people.e.g.recently even in uk couple has been ask to pay for atrocite on dalit on foreign land.
        Political freedom we have seen in Bihar recently where dalit electorate have been forced out of his village by the upper caste because he stood up in election in front of them(reference atrocite tracker)
        Economic freedom yeah we have seen that most of haryana where most of them are landless labourer and depend on other caste for livelihood ( rajyasabha debate)
        Reservation have helped dalits no doubt in that, but not that much that was expected. Still 3% of upper caste hold more than 70% of administrative post
        Representation in Indian media (which is mostly private)of dalits is front of every one.and without government policy support we can see that society still not able to accept them.does that mean dalit don’t have intellectual to come in media like job
        And Indian judicieis best whole world knows it where judges select themselves and creating a separate varna system where judge decide who can become judge. How to increase represemtation in that I don’t know.
        This needs a social introspection and also in policy introspection
        Was Poona pact was a mistake I’m our history.we still idoilise those leaders who actually support varna system.
        This India will be a real equal society when matrimonial ad will come without caste identification

        Thanks for reading and point out my mistake

  • Deepak

    Dalit issues-
    Traditionally indian society believe in hierarchy and divide task based on the same. Dalit were given lowest rank and menial work. various atrocities on them include-
    Social- exclusion from well ponds temple, sit on ground, their women beaten and raped by upper castes , not allowed to copy the custom of upper caste e.g horse ride celeberation (ghudchadi) .
    Economic- low paid job. Continuing manual scavenging.
    Poltical- Low represetation in poltical parties except BSP.
    Administration- Low represetation in police, civil service, judicary.

    now Constution tried to empower them with article 14,15 ,17and afirmative action.Other safeguard include SC/st (Prevetion of atrocties) act,Separate national commision for SC.
    This has increased aspiration of dalits but reality has not changes

    Rising cases of conflict because aspiration of dalit has increased and upper caste see this as a challege. To assert their supremecy they resort to violence.

  • KC

    Our Constitution has provided various safeguards to the Dalits.A number of laws have been passed in the independent India to protect the interests of the Dalits. But still we observe instances of ban on entry of Dalits into the temples; derogatory occupations like manual scavenging, grave digging,sweeping etc being exclusively reserved for the Dalits; Dalit children being forced to clean the toilets in the schools; separate utensils for Dalits in eateries, tea stalls; Dalit men not being allowed to come on horses as a part of pre wedding ritual;hair cuts being refused to the Dalit people; they are not allowed to fetch water from the common wells; they are not invited to the celebrations in the village and functions organised by them are not attended by the upper castes.These trends are more common in rural areas than in urban areas where discrimination has taken a more sophisticated form.In the urban areas , a lot of importance is given to caste at the time of fixing matrimonial alliances and alliances with lower castes are usually not preferred.All these hurt the dignity of an individual.

    As long as Dalits confirm to these demeaning practices, they are spared without any physical harm.But as soon as a Dalit challenges these and acts contrary to them, the so called upper castes feel offended and the life of that person comes in danger.There are rampant cases of honour killings where a dalit is killed and his family is ousted from the village just because he married outside his caste.The institutes like Khap Panchayats have provided legacy to such crimes.A Dalit woman is even more unsafer.There have been increasing cases of dalit women being raped by upper caste man just because they felt that these women did not have any rights.The killing of 2 innocent Dalit girls of Badaon village in the most brutal manner is a recent example.

    There are many reasons responsible for this.Firstly, the discrimination on the basis of caste has been deeply routed in the societal mindset throughout the centuries.This has been ingrained in the psyche of the people and no law matters to them.Secondly, the dalits are dependent on the so called upper castes for their economic well being.Thus, they do not dare to raise an organised voice against the atrocities committed on them.Thirdly, even when they gather the courage to raise the voice, the indifferent attitude of the police and inefficiency of the judiciary try to suppress them and ultimately justice is denied to them.This emboldens their exploitation by other castes.

    The sensitization of the people who man the institutions which are responsible for maintaining law and order and providing justice along with the change in attitude of the people can only help to end this menace of caste discrimination.

  • gs

    By witnessing incidents like these it more than proves the fAct that dalits aren’t safe in this society. Various constitutional provisions have been provided along with laws like prevention of atrocities against SC, Act to prevent such heinous crimes and caste discrimination.
    These measures have helped in condemning and preventing in suppressing this evil of ancient laws. But the reAl difference would come only when we as a society as a whole would change our mindset. It does sound a bit utopic but a mental revolution is needed.
    Yes policing, justice and suppressing such elements who undertake such activities like lynching and burning is the needed the most. But If we don’t provide education in a way that would broaden the mindset of the people, that does not lift them above such minute differences over which we keep differentiating each other. Then all the efforts made in the form of laws and reservations would fail.

  • Arunkumar Shanmugam

    Are dalits safe in India? The answer is yes, they are safe in India but not fully. There are many legislations made for the upliftment of dalits. Some of them of served their job but not fully. In the topic reservation also, every one is saying that the reservation system should be improved but only few of them are saying it should be abolished. So,mindsets of people are in favour of dalits only. So, compared to previous situations, dalits have improved but not all of them are improved.

  • sindhu

    India,akanda bharathi which is home for diversified communities,castes,religions wholly termed Indians.Dalits from past 7 decades to hitherto facing many atrocities and are vulnerable to cruel ideologies.Albeit our Indian constitution have National commission for ST’s and ST’s(65th constitutional amendment act) under article 338 which monitors the safeguard them under law.This is infringed by society especially the upper caste ones.many instances like sexual violence against dalit women, driving families out of their homes for nominating in panchayats, washing the temple shrines with holy water if dalits enter temples etc.,Even from the refrence of vedas it is as dalits are not allowed to have education and even their shadow is not supposed to reach upper caste..and recent incident of burning the dalit family alive not sparring children is so folly tragedy.considering all these dalits were definately not in safe place socially,economically inspire of having laws to defend them.

    Following might yield better results in securing dalits :
    1)more representation of Dalits and adivasi might project their interests and safeguard them.currently it is 15.47% for dalits and 8.66% for adivasi.
    2)reservation is although playing effective role but should reach the root levels and thwarting unauthorized people claiming it.
    also sc and st students,employees lowers their confidence feeling they are not on par with upper castes and and some might depend on reservation analysing they have wider oppurtunities and doesn’t pave towards hard work.hence caste reservations should be replaced with low economic reservation.
    Despite the political strategy,government measures,laws etc., the only way to overcome these atrocities against lower caste is making the upper caste come out of their caste dogma and realise that they are creatures of the nature they worship.

  • Shubham

    Dalits as everyone know are some of the most oppressed section of the society. Since pre independence era many social reformers like Jyotirao Phule,Rajaram Mohan Roy to mahatma Gandhi worked effortlessly to eliminate caste based discrimination in India not per se casteism .
    After independence social and economic uplift meant was one of the objective of congress and national govt at large . But the entire focus was through better legislation as reservation policy .
    But what has been witnessed in recent times has been increasing violence against Dalits . They face oppression by upper caste, police doesn’t register FIR against upper caste easily, lower caste among Christian and other religion are not recognised as SC, political parties engages in caste politics . India is a land of thousand problems but millions solution as well.
    Reservation policy has helped already better off section among Dalits, we need to rationalise it not because it’s not needed but because it is not enough. The policy is pitting upper caste section against them as reservation is increasing and OBCs due to their political clout are gaining benefit as we saw in cases of jats in up and Gujjars in Rajasthan.

    Economic criteria should be the guiding spirit behind reservation though constitution and Supreme Court didn’t permit it and political class may fear of losing vote bank but this is the need of the hour.
    The answer to the question can’t be straight forward and the dimension of safety does not include physical safety only but social,psychological and economic safety too which seems disillusionary.
    Implementation of the laws for Dalits , stringent punishment for the offenders who violate their rights, better facilities for their skill upgradtion and providing them with adequate fe employment opportunities along with sensitising all on this issue will help in along way

  • Neha

    Constitution of India by various safeguards like article 14 article 17 tried to abolish this age old discriminatory practice
    even came with legislative like protection of civil right act, sc st prevention of atrocities act at same time provided with national commissioner for sc and sc to overseas implementing as such
    BUT it seems even after 6 decades of independence DALITs ARE YET NOT SAFE in india
    Facts in support
    1 intercaste marriage only 5% in which maximum are in between nearby Castes.. Ps marriage is biggest symbol how open are society is
    2 they are massacred, raped bitten and ostracised from society when they ask fr equal treatment in basic needs like to have water from same well, to enter the temple, or to ride on horse in their marriage
    Eg LAXMANPUR BATH massacre
    3 village which constitute 70 % of india’s population is still repository of this practice where houses are still stratified according to one’s caste and DALITs lives on outskirts. Indeed ambedkar’s apprehensions came true
    4but even city in not inocuous there dalits are expected to do MENIAL job there life style criticise, rental accomodation denied and called with coneitedness as chamar, bhangi and all
    5 reservation which was supposed to correct historical wrong. Provide opportunity for those to grow whose backbone was broken by this practise But reality is it didn’t succeed their representation yet 11% although their population 17% and that too this 11% is not from all but simply a creamy layer who’s is again and again able to take benefit from this
    6laws are made but their implemention is in hand of people who themselves are mirror of society can’t be perfect then society itself
    Hence they are also poor implemention like fir not registered, not reading information to victims or even threatened to settle matter outside
    7 at judicial level disappointed by delays, increasing cost and impuniy
    This is result of failure in our education policy which have failed to inculcate scientific temperament , respect to diversity , humanity and doctrine of not treating any other human being as means to ur end, no dicrimination based on birth in people
    No law can be successful unless social and moral conscience of society is aligned wd it.

    • Neha

      I m new over here. And can see have done various spelling mistake sry for that

  • Samuel Cs

    Men are created equal and caste was bred after birth.
    Dalit reflects the low caste not the low level of men. The perceived stigma of the casteism makes them vulnerable and open to all types of attacks and threats. The only way is not empowering them but educating the people.

  • Rohit Roy

    India is a country of various race,culture,religion,it may possible that our neighbour may be of different racial and cultured,but there is unity inspite of these diversity.Though at the earlier stage there was prevailing and predominating class division,and Dr.ambedkar was one of the victim of that,but now the situation has changed.There are so many protectection given to the Dalits (article 14,15,17,25 etc),though some disruptive incident also occur nowadays but this are not persistent incident,it alleviate qickly,it not become a parmanent issue.
    Dalits are not as developed as rich,because of unwareness,many of them not know what the protection goverment given to them.Sometime they are settled their mind as backward class and willingly not go for education.

    so,I,think goverment and also common people duty would be refresh their mind and keep away their backwardness mind from their mind.

  • jothi_pm

    Dalits are one among the most vulnerable and oppressed people of Indian society.Caste is the main culprit which made them so, which divided people into different groups just by birth and the profession they practice. why it exists even now? Its because people are likely used to that or the professions of one category is not being taken by the other category or is it safe to be in their caste as there is no way of changing their caste since they have born already with caste tattooed on them.

    Actually we can say, dalits are safe in our country with their reservation in public educational institutions, public employment opportunities, to be availed of most of the social welfare schemes and developmental reforms. So Dalits are by their caste benefited in terms of their economic development.

    There are laws like prevention of atrocities act for SCs & STs to improve their social inclusion and security. To prevent and punish whoever discriminates people, commits violence against them, was constitutionalised to empower their social status in our society.

    No they are not safe in terms of political participation. Though there are safegurads to encourage SCs/STs development, most of upper caste rude people are still oppressing them. There are situations still in rural Bihar, Uttar pradesh, dalits are refused to enjoy basic rights like going into temples, wearing chappals and also in the way of untouchability. The narrow-minded people are committing violence and crimes against dailts in number of ways like, murder, gang rape, assault , etc. So stringent laws are needed to enforce the equality among people

    Being emerging as a great economic power in the world, its also time to look back to historical times, how far the weaker sections of the society has been improved till now, what are all the things need to be performed urgently to safeguard dailts, how to emphasize indian people that constitution treats every citizen is equally, when there comes the fundamental rights, and the constitution needs tolerant citizens with all sorts of diversities in the country

  • Rohit Roy

    India is a country of various race,culture,religion,it may possible that our neighbour may be of different racial and cultured,but there is unity inspite of these diversity.Though at the earlier stage there was prevailing and predominating class division,and Dr.ambedkar was one of the victim of that,but now the situation has changed.There are so many protectection given to the Dalits (article 14,15,17,25 etc),though some disruptive incident also occur nowadays but this are not persistent incident,it alleviate qickly,it not become a parmanent issue.
    Dalits are not as developed as rich,because of unwareness,many of them not know what the protection goverment given to them.Sometime they are settled their mind as backward class and willingly not go for education.

    so,I,think goverment and also common people duty would be refresh their mind and keep away their backwardness mind from their mind.

  • riteish

    WHAT ABOUT THIS @BLACK MAMBA???
    firstly they are given financial support by the goi (thinking that every sc,st,obc are poor)…..2ndly the are given reservation in schools,colleges etc. (thinking that despite of money support they are still weak)…..3rdly after they complete their graduation again in the form filling(ex- 1500/- for gen. 500/- obc, 50/- sc,st OR even free of cost)…….after filling form again giving reservation in govt. job (thinking that they are still not able to compete)……….after giving job again they are given promotion in there jobs(thinking that they are still not streamlined)…..and you are saying that they are not beneficiaries….after about 60 years of reservation they are still not streamlined…the reservation is increasing still today for some rubbish vote bank policy….moreover they demand reservation in private job also……what else they want that govt. should feed them by their hands.???
    COMING TO THE TOPIC OF DISCUSSION…………..
    a lot of constitution laws,amendments,rules and regulations in support of minorities….
    someone said that they are called dalits which itself means inferior….for their information i want to say that they are also called “harizans” by gandhi,,i think u may be knowing the meaning of this word.
    someone said B.R.AMBEDKAR was there leader or well wisher…..read about him he later converted tlo buddhism..
    someone said upper caste use their title for their superiority……my title is raj which doesnot denote any superiority being an upper caste (it was actually in fear of the discrimination by the harizans that i got this title)
    someone says there is dominance of upper caste everywhere………i m from jharkhand…..tell me a single name of c.m of this state of upper caste or even of neighbouring bihar???
    a country like india where only the majority is ruined…..if it would be same case for upper caste ..no one would be there to discuss it,but it was a dalit so we are discusiing it, or is popular on media..
    it is sin in india to be born in UPPER CASTE,DOUBLE SIN IF YOU ARE A POOR IN UPPER CASTE.
    dalits are always a stronger force as they are always united and not separated like the upper castes,a cbi probe for burning of two children of dalits whose actual cause is still not known but upper caste are blamed…..and my college senior is brutally murdered by some mafia in kharagpur….we are demanding cbi probe for atleast 3 months…still no response from govt.( you can check it out at twitter #JusticeForSaurabh) because he was a upper caste…this is the reality of india.

    • Abs111

      hello friend……though i m nt black mamba bt i m no less venomous….;)…do u knw oppressed castes(called lower castes by some fools) used to beat drums announcing their arrival so that they do not come in contact with these fools….do u knw these castes were denied of public goods….do u knw they were denied religious knowledge…..do u knw these classes are the original inhabitants of this country bt still sidelined…..it is these reasons why they r poor and this system was in practice for centuries….and u look exhausted jst in 50-60 yrs of reservation given to them……is it that this mentality has changed completely??ur views r filled with UPPER CASTES AND LOWER CASTES…..i got my answer….:)….. i hope u may be aware that reservation is a representative term….so these concessions are justified if it increases their representation….which is still nt the case…..and plz don’t limit B.R. ambedkar to such a narrow interpretation…he was a great scholar..and a proponent of liberty,equality and fraternity…and go and read why he changed to buddhism(rather watch pradhanmantri…achha rhega…;))….u talked abt c.m….are u aware of the incident when the whole temple including the idol of god was washed jst bcoz a c.m. from oppressed class visited there….it is such mentality we have to fight…..yes i m also saddened of the foolishness of my ancestors…bcz of which this generation is suffering..especially EWS………

      • minaxi

        Agree….

      • riteish

        K SIR i got u….
        u are saying that they were denied of public goods,religious knowledge…….k i agree that earlier or even now there are some cases……..and you say that reservation is in effect of this……..can u explain why we are sufferer despite of our ancestors did…….britishers also did wrong,muslim ruler forcibly converted many hindus and even killed when opposed……why u r not punishing them and why only us???
        u said my views are full of upper and lower caste or oppressed caste in ur term……how can i overcome with this view when since from my childhood i came to know that sc,st means 22.5% and obc means 27%,,goi seperated us and u blame me…….
        u say reservation system increases their representation……it is actually to make them….u can even reach to any higher posts but still in ur mind a thing always will be in ur mind that i am here bcz of reservation…….50-60 years of reservation still not streamlined…..how much time more u need????(BRACK OBAMA CAN BECOME THE PRESIDENT OF AMERICA WITHOUT ANY RESERVATION AND U NEED RESERVATION FOR EVERY STEP OF UR LIFE)

        B.R.AMBEDKAR not only converted himself but also his wife and his 500,000 followers bcz he saw buddhism as a means to end caste based system in india ( firstly reservation for them,laws to protect them and then converting them to buddhism…????))read in wikipedia if i m wrong……..even after being such a great leader he was unable to uplift their condition,if he thought that conversion is only solution then why he demanded reservation or so called poona pact and why he not converted all of them to buddhism if it was the only solution?????

        u make me aware of the incidents of washing god,or many type of cases in which they are victims……..do u know any of the case in which an upper caste is dominated by harizans….answer is no….bcz noone cares for it……i can give u an example i am from bit sindri,dhanbad(bitsindri.ac.in) , with 50% reservation in my college….with dominance of ur oppressed class….they misuse the money given to them for their education in drinking,smoking,satta etc. ……they can abuse you but u cannot response to them….there are many cases even i was beaten by them harshly of only a silly reason…..no one was to hear me…no support from colleagues or teachers…even they said don’t go to police station otherwise their case will always be a stronger case and 3 months unbailable jailed like things.
        no one cares for these type of news………take the hot topic now of two children being burned by upper caste ..cbi probe for it…does anyone one bothered to talk about the 3 upper caste person who were dead bcz of this quarrel earlier…..answer is no……… this is also the reality of india……
        u are saying that reservation system can end this mentality….u r wrong bro…..this reservation system provokes these type of mentality…..
        yes i m also saddened of the foolishness of my ancestors …bcz of whis this generation is suffering..especially brahmins

        • aashish 2000

          I understand the situation and what you conveyed is true, but the same has happened opposite in my college. Upper caste dominated society suppressed dalits and beaten to death. Is the social justice equitable to all?……No, if you consider a sample limited to a place it never satisfy whole when you are considering non static things such as human minds.
          When you take India as a sample, weaker sections are most vulnerable to atrocities. Who is doing manual scavenging in your city? Who is the person coming to collect waste materials from your home? A Statistics said that all these inhumane activities taken by weaker sections.
          The constitution instead of providing reservations, if they banned the caste names for children, active involvement of rural families in the economic wheel run which reduces their leisure time, Strengthen implementation of law and order irrespective of caste.
          But, unfortunately, its not happening because of more participation and influence of elites in three pillars of democracy.

          • riteish

            i agree that weaker sections are more vulnerable to atrocities…….but it is also true that upper castes are also sufferers…….
            i don’t know the situation of ur college but it is true fact that there is unity among weaker sections of society whereas it is absent in the upper caste….if u hit one of them…all will protest….if u hit one of the upper caste only he will b there to protest (not going to exception case)

            ur next point is banning the caste name instead of giving reservation……..it will not be supported by both the upper and opressed caste……upper caste thinking of their dignity and weaker thinking of their benefits…..Ex-telling hindu and muslim to follow the same religion type condition.

            there was a discussion on this topic b/w me and my teacher ,…it took 2 and a half hour but still no conclusion…..i also want the upliftment of the weaker section but how is the question?????
            and it is also true that reservation is not the solution….bcz if it was the solution then why there is no any effective result even after 50-60 years of it…..giving reservation on the basis of bpl is also not possible……….

            it is a mental status of human that stop us to unify,that stops fraternity,methodological individualism concept,….there should be a system in which they can fulfill their needs not depend on feeding them….they can be made strong…..BUT HOW IS THE QUESTION???????

            • aashish 2000

              If anything happen to elites there is no need of support because he can do whatever he want silently. It happens in so many cases. I’m not sure in your case.
              Yes, agreed with your point, its related to mental status of human rather than physical. Change happen in stages not at once due to people are change resistant.
              Gradual process is need to change the minds of people by
              1. Government divides the castes into four groups. And identify people on those groups rather than caste based such as Income. Because all people belong to caste fall in one or other group.
              2. Stop caste based names in school will reduce the differences in children
              3. Non Caste based politicians has to be elected for this atleast people in urban areas has to be educated.
              If these happens in step by step we can see change in the society.

              • riteish

                why u r comparing upper castes with elites…….all upper caste are not elites……..what can a poor will do silently??? ok forget it,,,
                ur first point i.e reservation on basis of income is not so much practical……it will take a lot of time to explain it…….it may be clear from the fact about no. of person paying taxes in india…….it is india….businessmen will never show their real income……fake bpl…fake income…fake profit….corruption….bribe…..will not able to make it a success,.

                2nd point resembles more with advertisement of idea ,,,,,,,it may be considered into account……but practically very tough to implement…….

                non caste based politician is also not possible in present scenario hving resrevation in political system also……….and non caste it means all are hindus…..like christians….like muslims…….hindu is such diversified that it is almost impossible to unify it.

                education is only the prime factor that can remove all discrimination…..ethical learning can only unify us……….so it would be better to think how could we able to make the weaker sections of all the caste educated.??

                i appraise ur thinking sir….

                • aashish 2000

                  Your points are good ,but I would like to remind you about one situation what you are saying impossible. Gandhi also faced the same that you stated diversified. He achieved tremendous success by implementing. So, I believe if you don’t start doing it, then how can put you statement as Impossible.
                  I consider Impossible is Nothing for humans. Because, we have seen rapid change in various sectors and if you don’t see change in any then its waiting for you to make it happen.
                  I agree with your point Education, Unified methodology can possible by education, but the type of education that parents are seeking for their children is Billon dollars question because education is depend upon parents will.
                  I gave example as income, but that is not major factor for making groups. The idea in my brain is
                  1. Decentralisation of grievance cell. A special board with participation of civil society has to form to look over on Grievances Under CM in every state. Any complaint will directly taken over by this board irrespective of pune, clerk, divisional Head, IAS, IPS, Ministers or even CM if they violate rules by corruption, not working etc.
                  2. Remove Caste column in all applications of government or private. Instead of that categorised them as ST/SC, Most Backward, Backward, Forward.
                  This all happen when genuine administrator/ government is in place. Hoping we can change it by putting interest of government ahead than any.

                  • riteish

                    if u remove the caste column then the looser will be so called opressed class….giving them status as most backward or backward….is currently also available(obc-other backward class)…….
                    putting the people in need…… in the list of backward class irrespective of their caste is only the solution…and culprits should be punished based on crime not based on their caste….that can create the feeling of fraternity……
                    i also think that nothing is impossible and atleast one should try to work for it ……..but this problem is so deeply rooted in society like corruption that caanot be overcome so easily…….let’s hope for a unified india free from all these debates/discrimination…..but fact is that we can only hope…..
                    a lot we have discussed now……..haapy dussehra frnd…. 🙂

                    • aashish 2000

                      Hope will come true if we start walking towards it. Any way Happy Dussehra…

            • लक्षित रणवाँ

              But bro. you should first read History, how Dalits are always oppressed by upper caste(Bahamians , Kshatriya).Rather than argue in Negative way, please try to observe things in positive sense and put Smart solution.Reservation was given to upraise that weaker section that always meant for slavery work for upper caste.And who say that reservations not a solution?

              • riteish

                i also don’t deny the fact that my ancestors oppressed dalits…don’t given them respect,untouchability etc. etc.
                i don’t hv much knowledge of history also…..but can u answer why i should be ounished for the sin of my ancestors…….. in my whole life i have not stopped any of these to go to temples….stop them to touch me….abuses any one of them……disrespected any of them……even my friend list is full of them….someone being too close that an upper caste can’t be……what is my fault???????
                and if still want to punish me for my ancestors did in the history….then please go through this history which is full of very good works of muslim rulers….britishers…….go and find any of their children and punish them…./////

        • Abs111

          “There is nothing more unequal than equal treatment of unequal people”…… The biggest irony is that u see ur sufferings which r far lesser than what the oppressed classes suffered……I agree u may have to work hard to get admission in ur college..or to get a job than them….bt is it equivalent to treatment like an animal??maybe u see life as only getting an admission or getting a job that’s y u saw 22 or 27 %…..I dare if anyone from the orthodoxy can deny to take money from a bank personnel of oppressed class…I dare if anyone working in any organization would give up his work jst bcz some of his companions are frm oppressed class….is nt nt strengthing??this is how reservation helps….Barack Obama is an exception.. And they say exceptions r nt rule….did it stop racist attacks in America???is religion a monopoly of orthodoxies??is it reliable to trust a book like dharmshastras and all??why should anyone denounce and change his religion jst bcz of few elements…y nt provide them safeguards?? Ambedkar was liberal and rational….his conversion was more symbolic…go and read y he chose budhhism and nt any other religion(if available on wiki…hehe…)…..my sympathies with u bcz u became a victim of hooliganism…..bt there r many who r benefitting frm it and utilising it well….I m sure time will come when there will be no discrimination…..and plzz don’t talk like a castist like brahmins(do u knw it’s meaning)…..that will delay our dream……

          • riteish

            don’t make me understand what is the meaning of brahmins or give ur rubbish lessons…..
            i don’t hv much knowledge about ambedkar…….but if u know much than answer waht i hv asked???
            the point is not conversion to buddhism,the point is conversion……what type of symbolic conversion?? if he loved his caste…fought for it so long…..supported it…….worked for its upliftment…….again what he found in this caste that make him realize that buddhism is better than this……why he left behind so called ur majority of oppressed class….?????

            and i don’t need ur sympathy…..being of a poor family that even not able to feed 2 times a day…..we are know respectable in our society…..bcz we know to fight…..bcz we don’t depend on others to feed us……..bcz we know the meaning of competition……..bcz we know doing hard labour…….bcz we know our talent…..bcz we know our potential………these kind of sympathy is for u like guys who need support at every stage of life for their survival…….

            if u are talking about ur rights,needs,requirements then it is for streamlinig,removing discrimination…..and when i talk about the facts it is delaying ur dream……((hehehe))

            and reservaTION is no where strengthing u……..it makes u so weak that even after 100 years from now……. u will need it to survive…………

            • Abs111

              Happy dussehra friend…..:)

              • riteish

                same 2 u bro…..

                • TINKU KUMAR

                  hey @disqus_CfUK5NTkb9:disqus
                  In this debate u r being personal
                  u r preparing for IAS not for an normal exam
                  u have to give an unbiased view on the current situation and not to suggest what the topic of debate should be
                  i think Insightsonindia will take care of it .
                  ur views shows that u r mentally biased with lower class then how can u be think of an IAS officer , i dont understand anyway all the best of for ur bright future
                  🙂

                  • riteish

                    there is much difference b/w what u actually and what u write or speak…….none of ias aspirants ever had said that corruption is good but only 1% are free from corruption,all are endulged in this sin…….
                    i will take care that my answer should not be biased…..but i can’t care myself not to be biased..

              • Harshit J

                Hi friend, Just a thought, If you continue to bang your head against the wall, the only person getting hurt will be you, you cannot change the attitude of certain people. I really hope people like you make it into the services.

                Meant for @Abs111:disqus

                • Abs111

                  Thanxx…friend….if I started getting hurt from such small things then I don’t deserve to be in civil service…..waha to kitna sunna pdta hai…..:)

                • riteish

                  there are two types of person……
                  1st who either right or wrong but will say what he have to say in front of u……
                  2nd who don’t hv guts to face anyone….they will chuckle behind u…….
                  i really hope people like you make it into the sevices…….

                  • Harshit J

                    Cool. Thank You.

                    ->That way both of us are type 1. You and I have said what ever we truly feel about the topic.

                    ->With reference to your “hope”, I am doing everything I can, with your “wishes” I will give my best.

                    ->Lastly, Accept my best wishes for all your endeavours, may the process of CSE give you wisdom and empathy. Peace Mate.

                    • riteish

                      u would be in type 1 …if u had directly replied to me rather advicing someone else about my dumbness…

                      my best wishes are always with u…….

                    • Harshit J

                      Whatever makes you happy. Thanks for the wishes :).

            • Maverick_by_Nature

              we are know respectable in our society…..bcz we know to fight…..bcz we don’t depend on others to feed us……..bcz we know the meaning of competition……..bcz we know doing hard labour…….bcz we know our talent…..bcz we know our potential……… these are the words we need desperately in our lives not RESERVATION.

        • Bruce wayne

          Very good insight sir
          But few points as you said
          First about reservation it is still needed because 3% of people still holding 70% of administrative post.go for 100% reservation that will solve the problem when every one in government in proportion to our population. And it is called social pollution u haven’t done anything but u r still facing consequence. Like japani people facing radiation pollution even this generation have done nothing
          Now the Barack Obama example yeah they gave oppressed but they came to America or in south Africa just after industrial revolution and caste system here for thousands centuries.
          Now about the Poona pact you are wrong,that he didn’t want reservation,ambedkar asked about a special electorate.gandhiji ask him to have reservation.
          And personal story can’t be put in debate tell the evidence.
          I didn’t mean to offend u some how here just want to clarify few point.I think
          U become emotional in this debate

          • riteish

            very good sir …..totally agrre with u……..there should be 100% reservation……..and even more…….instead of passing mark of 35/100 it should be 5,10,15 respectively,…similarly in intermediate and in semesters of graduation…….medical,engineers,education are already included…….there should also be reservation in cricket team,football team,,etc.etc……100% for oppressed class….there should also be reservation in olympics,asian game………..one more thing……..by taking part in a olympic race there should also be reservation for the oppressed class of indians……..competing usa,japan,uk etc. in 100m race they should run only 50m and should be winner……..the 4 hit in cricket should be given a 6 for them……there should also be reservation for indian oppressed class in whole world….why only in india……….totally agree with u sir…

            i didn’t mean to offend u some how here just wanted to clarify few points.

            • Bruce wayne

              I can only laugh at your comment nothing else
              You want a monkey, bird and fish to run in same race to clubclimb the tree right treating them equally.
              But it’s not logical to have a debate with you who even don’t have sociology knowledge, and history knowledge my god what to say
              And yeah attachment to your identity.its like banging head with a wall.its like want to have a race with a guy who have been kept in chains for thousand years for generation .that race is just going to mocking them nothing else
              If u r so much capable why you even look at their seats focus your mind on that much that you get and clear there competition
              But thanks to know this kind of view tootoo
              Again sir no offense

              • riteish

                its a debate u give ur views and i will put mine…..u may be right in somewhere and i may be wrong somewhere….
                bUT IT WILL MAKE NNO EFFECT EITHER U LAUGH,CRY,WEEP…..

                i never told i hv much knowledge and i m excepting it everywhere………but problem comes when someone is layman and still thinks that he is expert.

                hum koi einstein ka dimag leke paida nhi hote…..na hi ambani k itna paisa leke…..na hi pankh lge hote hain hmme…..na machhli ki trah tairna hme pehle se aata hai……..sab yahin aa k sikhte hain……..khud ko kvi kmjor mat samjho……iss baar ki topper ira singhal hai….pehli to ladki……doosri obc…..tisri handicapped….agar bachpan se hi soch leti ki i m weak and cannot compete with birds and fish tab kvi top nhi krti……..wishing for ur bright future bro

                • Bruce wayne

                  Same to you sir.
                  But you keep giving those examples which don’t exist,or presented with twisted facts like again just thinking my self that m fish will I be able compete with fish in water,of course mental strength is needed but still there are some people who don’t want to accept these people neither professionally nor personally(honour killing)To have a argument it should be support with proper example(facts)
                  By the way in the end
                  With best wishes for future career

                  • riteish

                    its better to end the conversation here…..as u will suppoort waht u had experienced and i will support what i had experienced….there will always be contradiction…….my examples may not have theoretical description……but the fact is something which is always true irrespective of the situation…..my examples are true bcz i had not seen it …not heard it….it is experienced by me…i can guarantee it wherever i quoted myself as example……

                    we both are wasting our time here…..

        • MD

          It was quite expected the way debate turned with this sensitive topic……though i would like to remind the topic is are dalits safe in India and not reservations……since u brought it…I would like to tell that you speak of america without reservations but it did exist there before and also it still exists in form of “affirmative action”(u can verify this with any1 who studies at US university and even then people in US dont crib about it infact they concentrate more on their individual performance…). At that moment no one has the audacity to question US over this. Nonetheless speaking of India reservations exist even today because those categories are not given equal opportunities even 2day…now whether reservation is the only way or the correct way is a different issue…but yet speaking of the topic are dalits safe in India- well there are occurences which demonstrate the stigma they face even 2day be it some village or a city…though our govt is constantly taking efforts for the redressal of their grievances…yet i feel citizens should forget all the biases and remove the sense of caste as an identity from their minds.

          • riteish

            i know that i im deviating from the topic…but the circumstance forced it….my first thread is a reply to the question asked by various scholars here….
            and talking about america…..here i m talking about caste based reservation which is unique to india……..whereas reservation system to assist people of certain backgrounds are numerous…..including brazil has vestibular……china reserves positions for ethnic minorities and women…..germany has quota in their gymnasium system…..macedonia has quotas for albanians……uk has the equity act,2010….us has affirmative action……………….but nowhere there is caste based reservation…..
            now speaking of indian reservation…
            in india the term” caste based reservation” was changed to “depressed class” in 1932 by ambedkar and later to “sc/st” during the framing of the constitution 1950….
            reservation in india is present for backward class long before the independence comprising the princely states of vindhyas,in 1882,hunter commisssion,in 1901,reservation was introduced in maharashtra …in 1908 reservation by britishers to castes having little share in administration etc…
            but still some institute are kept away from this game of charity…..
            1.homi bhabha national institute,mumbai and its 10 constituents.,
            2.tata institute of fundamental research,mumbai
            3.physical research laboratory,ahmedabad,
            4.space physics laboratory,thiruvananthpuram
            5. indian institute of remote sensing,dehradhun…etc. etc.
            CAN U SAY WHY?? if u can really answer this question without any bias…u will get out what actually this game is….
            a capable candidate doesnot need any certificate of being from a lower caste to prove their worth.taking a seat just by showing your underpriviledged certificate,won’t give u anything,but just the degree or the job.

            • MD

              u say caste based reservation is unique to India and so is caste(except for portugal where they had ‘casta’ yet not so deep rooted like India). So you were wrong in the first place itself to remind how Obama was elected….and you mention how reservation is not present in some institutes. But what about when dalits specifically(not obcs or any other backward class) are not given. recognition for their achievements(there are cases where their research papers were not awarded and the reason explicitly told was caste!), their statistics manipulated….if their is no bias in the minds of people then why this happens,if there is then what is there to safeguard them. You also speak of capabilities …what are capabilities? how a man has capabilities…is he born with it or is it determined by caste? there are various opportunities and ur hardwork which determines capabilities..how can a person judge den who is capable and who is not…never the less i dont say reservation is the only or the best solution…but there is indeed a lack of options for safeguarding the interests of dalits. And from recent happenings one can ask himself..if dalit does not feel safe about his life then how can he be sure of his job or education?

    • Invincible

      loved ur and…but u slightly diverted from the main topic..it is about upper caste and lower caste( i.e. dalits).. not majority and minority..but I fully support ur ans.. the people of General category are in danger and they are victims of injustice..
      the concept of reservation system is also being violated..
      the condition of upper castes who are poor is worst in India..

      • riteish

        thnx…..i also know that it is about upper and lower caste i.e dalits….but see one of the reply saying that it is being a foolish to say lower caste rather use the term opressed class…….so i somehow diverted the topic to majority and minority so that they are not hurted by my words..

    • Pandit

      Read my post

  • EnigmaIndia

    Constitution of India provided “Right to Equality” as fundamental right and no person can be discriminated on the basis of race ,cast and religion.And we succeeded upto some extend to implement these provisions.
    Still our Schedule caste population facing discrimination in several fronts

    Economic- Larger number of schedule caste still under privilege and poor still depends on upper cast of village for their financial need
    Educational- As per government survey largest number of drop outs are from schedule caste.
    Political – Even though there is reservation but still it is difficult to find suitable candidates due to social and educational backwardness.

    Solution- First and foremost requirement is to change the mind set of people and need to educate childerns from elementary level regarding evil of untouchability

  • Rashmi Lather

    Recent incidents threw light on the dark side of the secular India,where one particular section is continuously suppressed and deprieved from economical ,political,social benefits .
    More appalling is the current scenario where police institutions ,civil societies act like blinds and insensitive towards humanity.
    Dalits are nevertheless being gifted with several govt policies,reservation..but these have broaden the gap between lower and upper caste. Even after 69 years of independence,we are caught in fetters of inequality .
    # reservation should be based upon financial conditions.
    # there should be police man in every locality ,if he be a dalit himself ,could be more good as the oppressed section will feel secure and confident.
    # schools should organise campaigns taking lower and upper caste students to gather.
    # educated youth should come forward and via street plays and home to home connection spread the idea of equality.
    # elites of rural areas should be encouraged to support the deprieved socially.
    These suggestions are long term actions but way to sure shot success

  • krishna gopi

    The current event being commented here is part of the greater picture of rising intolerance among the majoritarian section of the society against a weak minority. Recent history bears testimony to how well the state has managed to protect its minorities (including Dalits, given that till very recently they had little social space and economic importance except for their caste specific occupations). The irony remains that the very instrument of reservation which was meant to usher in some sort of social and political equality has instead been utilized to perpetuate the Caste System. SC and ST are synonymous to Dalit/ Low caste today. Myopic vote bank politics and illiterate electorates have time and again responded to “Caste appeals” and voted their caste leaders to power. Only later do they realize of having fallen a victim to identity politics!
    The hatred between Upper and lower castes(and also between sub castes of Upper/ Lower castes)
    usually stems from envy of social / economic disparity but readily finds expression in Caste Violence. Indeed it is almost impossible to escape this viciousness of the Caste System. While it has lost most of its economic significance, the “historical brutalities/ Oppression” inflicted on the lower castes give them an opportunity to bargain for relaxed employment provision. The plea of reservation fuels anger among the upper caste youth which feels being at the receiving end of this injustice.
    In the given circumstances, a solution seems elusive and hence the frustation which manifests as violence. However, we forget that Indian culture has been based on the premise of tolerance.

  • sufi

    The word Dalit is used in India to identify certain class of people.Identification of an human being based on caste is unacceptable in itself .By giving reservation to this faction we ensure their participation in development,while letting them live with that identity remains entact.This identity is what stigmatizing them,this creates the mental model in other classes.Other higher classes still get driven by that mental model infused in them by societal beliefs.And this let them think about dalit in a lesser way,which many a time culminated in the form of opression.
    Dalit in country won’t be safe unless this mental proggramming of higher strata gets refined.And this refining process can not be acheived by merely enacting some stringent law against atrocities face by them.But government should work in the directuion such that they dont have to face atrocities at first place .This can be achieved by creating such a social atmosphere which can bring them on equal footing with others.And also by mobilizing the message of fraternity and equality in all quarters of the society.Its high time to give this issue central place at national forum.And to give a humane approach to this problem,so that identity biases in society will be ended soon.

  • Jaya Swatantra

    Are Dalit safe in India?
    Dalit word comes from Sanskrit word “dal” meaning broken, suppressed and these days Harijans are adopting this word to name themselves.Safety and security of any individual depends on education,awareness and competitiveness.Any person who is aware of his rights and duties and working for it is safe.Dalit safety must not be politicized .I have seen my one friend belonging to Sc community whose father had reputed job purchasing IIt form in less amount irrespective of his status and my one friend belonging to general category purchasing the form paying the full amount.Talking about Dalits who are still lagging behind for them government have sought reservations in order to bring them in mainstream.but once this imbalance is vanished let there be an equally competitive environment and platform for all as quality must not be compromised.

  • Sandeep Kumar

    -As far as the safety concerned with the dalits,Government has already enacted various rules and regulations under different provisions of articles in the constitution.their safeguard has been ensured through various affirmative actions and state policies.

    -Various provisions has also been laid out in constitution in form of reservation for the upliftment of their social,political and economical status.

    -Despite of these many safeguards,still dalits are prone to misery by upper caste.they are still not enjoying full moral and sentimental status as upper caste people have, and the most important reason behind this is the economical dependencies of dalits on them.

    -Apart from the economical dependencies,sinks of localism and narrow mindness of the people also marginalised the dalits from various activities of the society and hence they are still victim of untouchabilty indirectly.

    -Various atrocities acts like schedule caste and tribe act 1989 etc claims their right against atrocities but it fails and the proof is clearly visible in form of different atrocities we are seeing in different parts of India.

    -Affirmative actions,constitutionalism,state actions and political equation can’t achieve the goal of their equal rights with dignity unless progressive social consciousness is drive by the people of the Indian society.

  • ssaurabh0711

    Dalits are still unsafe in India despite the safeguards provided by our constitution and various acts enacted according to the constitution.

  • @@the walk@@

    dalits refers to those who were once the untouchables,the origin of this can be traced indias deep rooted manusamritis laws of four fold division of caste,but dalits are not the parts of the four fold division of caste they are basically considered “outcaste”
    since ancient time these people are marginalizd,discriminated,exploited on the basis of the theory propounded by the manusmritis law.
    having ackowledging their share in the indian economy they constitute around 16% of indias population indian constitution and government has enforced the various laws–like under article 17 which talks about abolition of untouchablity ,preamble guarntees social justice,directive principles of state policy provides special care of sc/st in edu and social sector article,national commission of sc and st part ix and ixa provides reservation in panchyats and municipilaty,article 330 and 332 provides reservation in sc in loksabha and ligislative assemblies ,prevention of atrocities act 1989 act etc passed for providing legal protection to these groups,
    but the real challenge in india despite of all these these condition improved marginally and whenever they sat on the chair of power they treated like suspician derogatory way.
    their women abducted ,raped,if they somehow got good education than they are considers that their educaton is at the cost of upper class(reservation) all these although not sectioned by law but by societal laws like khap panchayats the fear is omnipresent
    even after more than six decades of independence the cancer of caste is persists its because that caste is not in the mind caste is in the blood of people the blood purifies the same way caste purifies as the basis of caste is on the notion of purification and pollution.
    its an irony in india that eveything from cow to caste everything is politicise thanks to the vote bank politics
    the problem is not with the law but the problem is in the attitude of the people
    however forgetting those days where dalits shade even got polluted the upper caste,they have to walk the bare foot.come outside after the sun set thanks to the social reformers which vehemtly opposed this and help in shaking the caste
    now they are seen in various sector of economy thanks to the industralisation and urbanisation
    concluding by famous mahatma gandhis–“the goodness of a society should be measured on the basis of that how it cares it vulnerable people”
    .

  • Pandit

    2000 sal ka gap 60 sal me to nahi bhar sakta. Agar real race chahiye to upper caste ko 2000 sal tak education nahi dena chahiye . Pura lifestyle dharavi jaisa hona chaiye . Fir race karni chaiye.Tabhi bhi 60 sal me bahot kuch badal chuka hai. Tathgat Tulsi ka nam suna hi hoga .Uska iq duniya me 2nd no. Pe hai. Nobel ke liye nominate hua tha .Par Indian government nahi bheja bcoz he is sc.So , Dalits are not safe in India.

    • No Name

      kya baat hai bro…first 3 lines shows the backward mentality of lower casts…..
      this; s the difference b/w upper cast nd lower cast ..hum chate hai ke lower cast wale study kre aur tum chate ho k 2000 saal tk study nhe kre…aur rhe baat reservation ke koi bhe upper cast wala against nhe hai reservation se but jo main problem hai ke har sc/st backward nhe hota hai…jis ko sach me need gai financially weak hai uss ko milna chaiyea…jis k ghar pr lights nhe hai un bacho ko colleges me reservation milna chaiyea…naa ke jin sc/st persons k ghar me AC hai unhe nhe milna chaiyea ….
      main root cause khud sc/st k kuch peoples hai jis ke wagha se actual me jo lower cast person deser krta hai reservation kam milta hai unhe …mere bhe sc/st frnds hai wo bhe reservation latee hai but unhe koi need nhe hai coz unke father ke income 70 -80 thousand per month hai college fee less than 3 thousand fir bhe har chez me reservation chaiyea …un logo ke wagha se jin logo ko need hai bagot kam financially support milta hai ……..jinta kahu utna kaam hai so hope u get me points ..don’t say dalits r not safe in india they r safe but.upper cast r not safe………….

  • Caste has become the convenient “hook” to hang the Hinduism portrait since Hinduism, that “rolling caravan of conceptual spaces”, is too complex a religion/way of life for the “people of the book” who have reigned supreme the past two millennia. Unfortunately, caste being the complex conundrum that it is, Hinduism almost always is seen through the prism of caste.
    Whatever the merits of this particular case, violence against the Dalit community has increased over the past few years. According to National Crime Records Bureau (NCRB) data, 47,064 cases of crimes against Dalits were registered last year, up from 39,408 in 2013 and 33,655 in 2012.
    Legislation against the caste system was introduced in India as early as 1850 under the Caste Disabilities Removal Act. After independence, it was only in 1990 that a law to shield the Dalits, the Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes (Prevention of Atrocities) Act, 1989, came into effect.
    Dalits have been the fastest to change and adapt in our society, but the others have found traditional roles hard to let go of. Everything from traditional land holdings to personal relationships are changing. In such a scenario, the Atrocities Act does serve as a deterrent, but unless the police machinery applies it forcefully, the implementation remains a problem.The Dalits are no longer dependent on upper castes for a livelihood. In fact, they often compete with them, and even do better.

  • Ajinkya

    With Dadri incidence followed by an incidence in Haryana, where dalit family was set afire left us thinking whether Dalits are safe in India or not
    WE,the people of India,living in the liberalized society, where liberty,equality and democracy are core principles, in such society, people are being killed for allegedly eating something, which we don’t like. It is an example of our intolerance towards those people
    Also, it’s an issue of law and order, where people to policemen ratio is as low as some 1000s to 1.
    Most unfortunate thing is, in such situation,political leaders, instead of taking stringent actions against accused,are playing blame game
    In our society, dalits are being seen as a large chunk of vote bank by politicians, who can easily be easily influenced by some pitty amount during times of elections. Dalits are not considered at par with the others, untouchability – which is strictly against constitution-is still being practiced against dalits. To make matters even worse, even police don’t look into the matters seriously
    By taking all these things into account, we sadly have to say that dalits are not safe in India, and proper measures need to be taken by the authorities

  • riteish

    now u can easily understand what i tried to proove…..the topic is deviated by me but this reality should also be in the mind of ias gems……..
    ‪#‎Presstitutes‬ का ‘कारनामा’ फरीदाबाद में भी:

    लोगों द्वारा SC /ST Act का दुरूपयोग
    मीडिया द्वारा PRB Act का दुरुपयोग और विभिन्न विभूतियों द्वारा सम्मानों के दुरुपयोग
    का इससे बेहतर उदाहरण नहीं मिलेगा।
    फोरेंसिक विभाग की रिपोर्ट कह रही है कि फरीदाबाद में “दलित” बच्चों के पर मिट्टी का तेल सीधे ऊपर से डाला गया था बाहर खिड़की से नहीं। The pattern of oil pouring was vertical not splatter. तेल की खाली बोतल बिस्तर के नीचे मिली और माचिस की अधजली तीली दीवार की अलमारी में। कोई घर के अन्दर भी नहीं आया था क्योंकि कुंडी अंदर से बंद थी और टूटी भी नहीं है। दलित जीतेंद्र का यह कहना भी गलत है कि वो दीवार में छेद से बच्चों को दूसरे कमरे में ले गया क्योंकि छेद इतना छोटा है कि उस में से कोई व्यक्ति निकल नहीं सकता। जीतेंद्र के हिसाब से 11 आदमी दीवार लांघ कर उसके घर में घुसे तो न तो दीवार के साथ के पौधे और घास कुचली हुई है और न ही 11 आदमियों के दीवार पर चढ़ने के कोई निशाना बने और न ही पड़ोसियों को पता चला।
    The forensic report finds the “source and origin of fire was from inside the room and not from outside”
    मेरे संज्ञान में मीडिया के 99% हिस्से ने यह रिपोर्ट नहीं छापी है।
    11 नामजद में से 7 राजपूत गिरफ्तार किए जा चुके हैं।
    जीतेंद्र के साथ साथ जिस तरह से मीडिया ने इस घटना को दिखाया है, इससे साफ साबित होता है कि देश को तोड़ने वाली ताकतों ने जड़ों को बहुत गहरे तक जमा दिया है। इनका साथ देने वाले विपक्ष के राऊल और आऊल क्या अपने बयान बदलेंगे???
    सोचने वाली बात है न कि 11 राजपूत एक चाकू तक लेकर नहीं नहीं चले अपने दुश्मन को मारने के लिए।
    Courtesy : Arvind Honde